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Klevv DDR4 2x8GB 3200MHz Hynix CJR Laptop RAM SODIMM RAM XMP RAM Overclockable
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lab501 » AMD Ryzen 3000 DDR4 Scaling – Part II – Samsung B-Die vs Micron E-Die vs Hynix CJR – English version
Scris de: Monstru, in categoria: Featured Articles, Procesoare & Chipseturi, in 24 September, 2019.
Samsung B-Die vs Micron E-Die vs Hynix CJR
One of the main changes that came with the launch of the X570 chipset, along with the launch of the third generation Ryzen processors, was the way the CPU communicates with the memory. Due to the changes implemented in the Zen2 architecture, along with the X570 platform, we can now reach much higher clocks for RAM, which was hard to imagine for the Zen and Zen + generations.
For this reason, I spent a good part of July analyzing the way in which performance scales with frequency and timings, in an attempt to help you get an accurate opinion about what kind of configuration is right for this platform. The results of these tests can be consulted here, in the first part of the scaling study, which I warmly recommend you to read if you have not already done so, because that is where I explained the most important elements of the memory / processor communication process.
However, even though we published one the largest AMD Ryzen 3000 RAM scaling studies, the results of this study were based on a single type of memory, you guessed it, equipped with Samsung B-Die ICs.
Basically, using the same memory kit, we tried to analyze the impact that clocks, timings, synchronous and asynchronous operating modes have on the performance, running a large number of tests.
Thus, we found that in order to achieve maximum performance we must use a 1:1 configuration with the highest clocks possible, with tight timings. Obviously, in daily use, we will not lose too much performance if we use a DDR4 3600 16-16-16 or a DDR4 3200 14-14-14 memory kit, the biggest differences being encountered in AIDA, not in games or real-life applications. Of course, the maximum performance for the AMD Ryzen 9 3900X CPU is a 1:1 DDR4 3800 configuration with tight timings – 1900MHz fClk being the highest setting where our CPU is fully stable.
However, even though we tried to offer as much information as possible regarding this subject and we hope we helped you in choosing the right memory kit, it was clear that the first part of our study did not deal with all aspects of this issue, leaving a series of questions without answer.
How do RAM kits equipped with other ICs behave? How does high density RAM behave? What happens if we use 4 memory sticks?
Well, as soon as we finished the first part of the scaling study, we started working on the second part. First, we tested Samsung B-Die dual-rank memory kits, as well as memory kits equipped with Hynix CJR ICs, respectively Micron E-Die ICs, and then we published individual reviews for each kit. Then, we tested the behavior of 4 memory kits equipped with Samsung B-Die ICs, and last but not least we used a high-end memory kit from GSkill in order to hit DDR4 4800.
What you see in this article is how I spent most of this summer, testing different RAM kits, along with AMD Ryzen 9 3900X and the excellent MSI X570 Godlike motherboard. Therefor, if in the first part we tried to see which clocks and timings combinations offer the best performance, today we will see if we can use cheaper RAM in order to achieve similar levels of performance with Samsung B-Die kits.
Buckle up, because this is going to be a long ride. And, of course, please excuse my english, which is obviously not my native language.
Tests of Samsung, Micron and Hynix memory chips on AMD Ryzen 3000
processors Ryzen 3000 processors have been on the market for several weeks, and they have become very popular among our readers. Memory manufacturers have announced special brackets for the new Ryzen processors and X570 motherboards. However, no one bothers to use these memory modules with B450 and X470 motherboards, except that manual settings may be required there.
This review was prepared by our forum member Reous.
Despite external differences, such memory sticks are most often equipped with DRAM chips, which have shown good compatibility with AMD platforms. As a rule, these are 8-Gb chips from Samsung, SK Hynix and Micron. We got the opportunity to test several G.Skill and Crucial kits.
Below is a brief overview of the three most common chips on the market:
Samsung 8Gb B-Die:
These K4A8G085WB chips are manufactured using a 20nm process.
Previously, they have shown overclocking friendliness, with clock speeds scaling almost linearly with voltage and latencies. Compared to the chips below, it is possible to achieve lower latency, which has a positive effect on performance. Unfortunately, the production of B-Die chips has been discontinued, so they will leave the market in the coming months. The corresponding forum thread lists memory strips on B-Die chips.
SK Hynix 8Gb C-Die:
The 8Gb type H5AN8G8NCJR chips are manufactured in 18nm and are third generation after MFR and AFR. Overclocking potential is high, but compared to the Samsung B-Die, you will have to sacrifice delays such as tRCDRD, tRP or tRFC. These chips, as a rule, are found on brackets with the declared mode up to DDR4-3600. Here we will also give a link to a forum thread where you can learn more about the strips on SK Hynix chips.
Micron 8 Gb E-Die:
Most often on the market you can find memory sticks on 8 Gb chips MT40A1G8SA-075:E (D9VPP), which are manufactured using a 19-nm process technology.
At the beginning of the year, they caused a sensation because they showed record overclocking values. Due to good overclocking capabilities and low price, these trims are recommended for purchase. But here, compared to Samsung B-Die chips, you will have to sacrifice some timings, such as tRCDRD or tRFC. See the forum thread for more information.
| CPU | AMD Ryzen 7 3700X (fixed at 4.1 GHz) |
| Motherboard | ASUS ROG Strix B450-I Gaming BIOS 2703 ABB |
| ASUS ROG Strix X570-E Gaming BIOS 1005 ABB |
|
| HDD | ADATA XPG SX6000 Lite 128GB M.2 Samsung SSD 850 EVO 250GB |
| OS | Windows 10 (Build 1903) |
| Video card | XFX Radeon R9 270X Black Edition |
| RAM | G. Skill Trident Z DDR4-3600 CL15-15-15 Samsung 8Gbit B-Die, Single Rank F4-3600C15D-16GTZ |
| G.Skill Trident Z DDR4-4000 CL19-19-19 Samsung 8Gbit B-Die, Dual Rank F4-4000C19D-32GTZKK |
|
| Crucial Ballistix Elite DDR4-4000 CL18-19-19 Micron 8Gbit E-Die, Single Rank BLE2K8G4D40BEEAK |
|
| Crucial Ballistix Sport DDR4-3000 CL15-16-16 Micron 8Gbit E-Die, Dual Rank BLS2K16G4D30AESB |
|
| G.Skill Trident Z Neo DDR4-3600 CL16-19-19 Hynix 8Gbit C-Die, Single Rank F4-3600C16D-16GTZNC |
|
| G.Skill SniperX Camouflage DDR4-3600 CL19-20-20 Hynix 8Gbit C-Die, Dual Rank F4-3600C19D-32GSXKB |
All tests were run at a fixed CPU frequency of 4.10 GHz at 1.325 V. This step was taken to ensure that clock speeds do not change depending on CPU temperature, which can adversely affect the result.
For clock speeds up to and including DDR4-3733, the ROG Strix X570-E Gaming motherboard was used, higher clock speeds from DDR4-4200 were obtained on the ROG Strix B450-I Gaming motherboard. Versions with the ComboPi 1.0.0.3 ABB patch were used as BIOS. We tested 2x 8GB single-rank and 2x 16GB dual-rank sticks on Samsung, SK Hynix and Micron memory chips.
We ran various tests in DDR4-3200, DDR4-3600, DDR4-3733, and DDR4-4200+ when available. All kits with the exception of the peer-to-peer Micron could not provide clock speeds higher than DDR4-4200, either the memory chips did not allow such high frequencies, or the BIOS was not optimized. We set the maximum VDIMM voltage to 1.50V to optimize latency. All timings are shown in the following table.
<>Samsung, Micron and Hynix Memory Chip Benchmarks on AMD Ryzen 3000 9 Processors0016 Overclocking Infinity Fabric on DDR4-3200
VEGA 56/64 extra downvolt | Page 8
Alexsandr36rus
Forum friend
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#141
beavismining said:
For information: on old firewood Adrenalin 201919.
11.3
Here is also a safir pulse samsung, but it gives 50.5mh at 1000-935 View attachment 136270 And what are your timings? here are the timings of this —RC 36 —rcdrd 11 —rcdwr 5 —rp 11 —faw 13 —rrdl 3 —rtp 4 —REF 65535
I saw that your frequency is holding 1028, how is this even possible?) ) Vega 64 or something)Click to expand…
56 can be 1028 on timings. not everything is true
Computeruniverse coupon for 5 EURO / FW3LOFR / What if)
souvenir
Forum friend
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#142
beavismining said:
Here is also safirka pulse samsung
Click to open.
..
dude, where do you get such timings) I’m just in shock) either you have porridge on hynix, or even worse on sams)
Alexsandr36rus said:
not everything is true
Click to expand…
what the hell do you have there for sams something like that) I have the most worthless 980 takes. Here, purely for fun, substitute these, will there be an improvement in frequency?
winamd.exe —i 0 —CL 20 —RAS 30 —RCDRD 14 —RCDWR 13 —RC 38 —RP 14 —RRDS 3 —RRDL 3 —RTP 6 —FAW 12 — CWL 8 —WTRS 4 —WTRL 9 —WR 14 —REF 65535 —RFC 260
Last edit:
beavismining
Friendly person
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#143
souvenir said:
dude, where do you get such timings) I just xs)
Click to expand.
..
apparently in the trash)) throw off the timings for samsa plz)
souvenir
Forum friend
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#144
beavismining said:
timings norms
Click to expand…
winamd.exe —i 0 —CL 20 —RAS 28 —RCDRD 14 —RCDWR 12 —RC 38 —RP 14 —RRDS 3 —RRDL 3 —RTP 6 —FAW 12 — -CWL 8 —WTRS 4 —WTRL 9—WR 14 —REF 65535 —RFC 260
look for the max frequency on these, then lower RC (min 36), RP min 13, raise RRDL to 5-6, lower rtp to 5
all this in turn as good luck card
immediately put 1028 not stsy, there is no point higher, lower if you don’t take 10 MHz you go down, the core is 1100 or 1150 as you like more in terms of consumption
beavismining
Friendly person
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#145
souvenir said:
winamd.
exe —i 0 —CL 20 —RAS 28 —RCDRD 14 —RCDWR 12 —RC 38 —RP 14 —RRDS 3 —RRDL 3 —RTP 6 —FAW 12 —CWL 8 —WTRS 4 —WTRL 9 —WR 14 —REF 65535 —RFC 260
look for the max frequency on these, then lower RC (min 36), RP min 13, increase RRDL to 5-6, lower rtp to 5
all this in turn, as the card is successful
immediately put 1028 not stsy, it makes no sense higher, lower if you don’t take 10 MHz down, the core is 1100 or 1150 as you like more in terms of consumptionClick to expand…
Thank you very much! stupid the best, tomorrow I’ll be in the mood
Alexsandr36rus
Forum friend
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#146
souvenir said:
dude, where do you get such timings) I’m just in shock) then you have porridge on hynix, then on sams it’s even worse)
that damn thing what do you have there for sams then this) I have the worst 980 takes.
Here, purely for fun, substitute these, will there be an improvement in frequency?
winamd.exe —i 0 —CL 20 —RAS 30 —RCDRD 14 —RCDWR 13 —RC 38 —RP 14 —RRDS 3 —RRDL 3 —RTP 6 —FAW 12 — CWL 8 —WTRS 4 —WTRL 9—WR 14 —REF 65535 —RFC 260Click to expand…
not, from the TPM manual I substituted from 64, 2pcs 959 the ceiling, and then it happens by 1 mistake per day, 1pc 986 (I just bought these 3pcs together, apparently fried, xs). One takes 1017, and a couple 1028.
But still in the worst case 51.7)
Let them work, tired of picking)
Computeruniverse coupon for 5 EURO / FW3LOFR / What if)
souvenir
Forum friend
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#147
Alexsandr36rus said:
from TPM manual substituted
Click to expand.
..
from the trm manual there rtp is lowered and rrdl is increased, which is not a good start for finding the highest frequency, some cards start to pour out with such settings. Here are the ones that I threw, this is a sure thing, if not they, then the diagnosis can be written down with a felt-tip pen)
Alexsandr36rus
Forum friend
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#148
souvenir said:
from the trm manual there rtp is lowered and rrdl is increased, which is not a good start for finding the highest frequency, some cards start to pour with these settings.
Here are the ones that I threw, this is a sure thing, if not they, then the diagnosis can be written down with a felt-tip pen)
Click to expand…
maybe I’ll try it somehow)
Computeruniverse 5 EURO coupon / FW3LOFR / What if)
beavismining
Friendly person
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#149
souvenir said:
winamd.exe —i 0 —CL 20 —RAS 28 —RCDRD 14 —RCDWR 12 —RC 38 —RP 14 —RRDS 3 —RRDL 3 —RTP 6 —FAW 12 —CWL 8 —WTRS 4 —WTRL 9 —WR 14 —REF 65535 —RFC 260
look for the max frequency on these, then lower RC (min 36), RP min 13, increase RRDL to 5-6, lower rtp up to 5
all this in turn, as the card
is successful, immediately set 1028 not sts, there is no point higher, lower if you don’t take 10 MHz down, the core is 1100 or 1150 as you like more in terms of consumptionClick to expand.
..
I tried these cool timings, but I was able to squeeze 55 hashes from Samsung without any problems. but why did you stop at the previous ones, these new timings are more suitable for cheap ee. they downvolt a little worse, you need to put 810mv on the core to run 1100 and 1150mhz core and then it will be 55mh but then it will not be possible to do even -25mv through AB
souvenir
Forum Friend
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#150
beavismining said:
I tried these cool timings, but I was able to squeeze 55 hashes from Samsung without any problems.
but why did you stop at the previous ones, these new timings are more suitable for cheap ee. they downvolt a little worse, you need to put 810mv on the core to run 1100 and 1150mhz core and then it will be 55mh but then it will not be possible to do even -25mv through AB
Click to expand…
Without numbers, this is a value judgment, according to the numbers, everything is fine there. On samsas, the downvolt is lower due to SoCa 1028, this is obvious, but not so much as to squeeze it down to 960 MHz.
Geode
Forum friend
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#151
souvenir said:
from trm manual there rtp downgraded and uprated rrdl
Click to expand.
..
And why suddenly reduced rrdl gives better results in terms of stability?
I always thought lowered rrds (and its corresponding faw x4) and rrdl were the other way around harder?
Alexsandr36rus said:
56 can be 1028 on timings. not everything is true
Click to expand…
Far from all.
I have two cards — they don’t even take 957 (i.e. the juice hasn’t even jumped to 1028 yet). Just an instant dump and that’s it.
I had to leave 936 and 50 max. I don’t know yet what to do with them, they just enrage (
souvenir
Forum friend
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#152
GeodE said:
Why all of a sudden
Click to expand.
..
rrdl is timing up
Geode
Forum friend
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#153
souvenir said:
rrdl is the up timing
Click to expand…
If we take an analogy with ddr4 — they always lowered it, just now I’m driving memory in Ryazan 3800x, and lowering gives instability, and increasing it is the other way around. Is something different on hbm?
souvenir
Forum friend
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#154
GeodE said:
If you take
Click to expand.
..
Otherwise, both hynix and sams behave most stably at timing 3, you increase it — you get more hashes, and more instability depending on the luck of the card. There are cards that work fine on rrdl 3, but on rrdl 5 they start to fall asleep with hw errors, but most of the samsas can rrdl 5, many hynixes can’t rrdl 5, there is no effect higher than 5-6 even if the card can.
Geode
Forum friend
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#155
souvenir said:
Otherwise, both hynix and sams behave most stably at timing 3, if you increase it, you get more hashes and more instability depending on the luck of the card.
Click to expand…
Very interesting, must try.
In general, it’s very strange — all these timings should work exactly the same as on other types of memory, and they all go down. It would be necessary to read jedec on hbm.
Even if we take stock bios 56 and 64, there rrds and rrdl go 4-5 and 4-6 respectively. On the 56th BIOS, the timings, as you know, are more tightly clamped, and everything is logical, there is less rrdl, although if it is on an increase, it should be the other way around
souvenir
Forum friend
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#156
GeodE said:
Very interesting
Click to expand.
..
There that 3 and 0 — there is no difference, there is a difference only when you give higher than 3. If you overestimate it a lot, well, like put 12 — then there will be a noticeable drop. So the range of this timing is from 3 to 6, 3 is more stable.
Geode
Forum friend
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#157
souvenir said:
If you greatly overestimate, well, like put 12, then there will be a noticeable drop. So the range of this timing is from 3 to 6, 3 is more stable.
Click to expand…
I’ll check, apparently the ether algorithm reacts so specifically
naroznyv
Friendly person
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#158
souvenir said:
winamd.exe —i 0 —CL 20 —RAS 28 —RCDRD 14 —RCDWR 12 —RC 38 —RP 14 —RRDS 3 —RRDL 3 —RTP 6 —FAW 12 —CWL 8 —WTRS 4 —WTRL 9 —WR 14 —REF 65535 —RFC 260
look for the max frequency on these, then lower RC (min 36), RP min 13, increase RRDL to 5-6, lower rtp up to 5
all this in turn as the card is successful
put 1028 right off the bat, it makes no sense to go higher, lower if you don’t take 10 MHz down, you go down, the core is 1100 or 1150 as you like more in terms of consumptionClick to expand.
..
on your screenshots you use RFC 249, please explain the difference (how much it affects stability) with RFC 260 (and it could be the same about RAS 28 and RAS 30 )
naroznyv
Friendly person
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#159
souvenir said:
I have the worst 980 takes.
Click to expand…
965-985 hash switching range
, respectively, that 980, that 965 — the hashes will be the same. And 965 is already sparse, for these cards it’s better to set 960 and wind up a little more downvolt so that the unsuccessful memory heats up less from the GPU / SOC
Newbee
Friendly person
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#160
Tell me, in the afterburner I activated all the checkboxes, but the slider is still not active, I tried several options for firewood.